Reading this made me realize how special our community is! We've been growing a Catholic neighborhood, where there are gatherings multiple times a week. We host dinner every Friday and there's brunch elsewhere every Sunday.
Most couples have kids and the adults without kids are like aunts and uncles to our kids. There's a joking competition on who is godparent to the most children (we have five godchildren and aren't close to winning this game). There are always lots of kids and babies at weekly gatherings and the two annual picnics. We host Thanksgiving every year and we invite any friends who don't have other plans, and if they have kids, they bring their kids.
Our single adult friends are, according to their personality, always ready to either read to a kid or play pretend and chase older kids or hold a baby. When I'm at brunch, having an interesting conversation with an adult, sometimes I stop and say, "Where's [my toddler]?" Then I look around and he's either playing with other kids supervised by a friend or has a friend reading to him. I usually say, "High trust society!" And go back to the conversation.
I've occasionally felt a small bit of what you wrote about, but only when visiting relatives without children. So much of my life is surrounded by big families that I forget we're not the norm! Big hugs to you and all parents for whom this isolation is a common occurrence, especially at holidays!
How incredibly beautiful. I'd love to hear more what you mean exactly by "growing a Catholic neighborhood." We're always hoping for like-hearted neighbors to move in (our area is older and is rapidly turning over).
Some of us young families from our parish do get together monthly for a casual dinner/social evening. With the twenty-something kids among us! We started last summer and it's been something I really look forward to.
We picked a few streets (within a block or two of the Catholic church and Bible study center) and have a real estate chat. We have a cadre of Catholic families all trying to live within a three block area.
Griffin, who lives in the neighborhood like I do, writes about our efforts here:
I loved reading how your perspective has changed over the years. There were times in early motherhood in which I felt unnoticed, and I’ve noticed the feeling creep back in whenever I’m pregnant — probably because I need help with managing a child and vomiting/using the bathroom, depending on trimester. There were stages in which we went out when we should have stayed home.
Over time, I’ve found it helpful to prepare my children for the gatherings (like, on a daily basis: following house rules, teaching not to touch, etc) and prepare myself to exit gatherings early. I feel less like my own individual self, and more like an important leader of this family who need me along with my husband to protect and meet their needs. It’s a good feeling of ceasing to exist, because a greater existence was borne. It’s taken time to get there.
And when I do get into conversation, I just try to ask a lot of questions of others, and it’s usually quite enjoyable for both of us, I hope.
I really appreciate this post and the opportunity to reflect on how our stages and handling of the hard situations change over the years.
"It’s a good feeling of ceasing to exist, because a greater existence was borne." - Yes, you're getting at something there. I feel it too! Perhaps it's touching on beginning to experience the beauty of interdependence in a culture that's obsessed with the opposite.
I too try to ask a lot of questions of others. I do have to mentally prepare myself though for no questions to be asked of me, which has often been my experience, as it seems no one knows what things I'm up to or that there would be anything interesting to talk about ;)
I agree, Amber, that bracing ourselves to be overlooked is fundamental to this. It’s not pleasant, but it can also provide great opportunity for us to show love in beholding others, rather than asking that we ourselves be beheld.
Christ sees me, that is enough. Is what I tell myself when I get sad about this.
Leah and Amber-Interestingly, I am experiencing in this moment. I am in my own home with a baby who needs to nurse and take a late nap. My in-laws came before Christmas (taking a deep breath and trying to remember that not everyone understands Advent like my Substack friends 😂). Anyway, my older kids have the Christmas crazies starting and everyone is engaging with them. That means present opening is happening out there without me. It is ok. My husband and in-laws are just trying to help while I focus on the baby. But even in my own home there is not really space for us. I can’t let her crawl at my feet while I cook when there are 3 extra cooks in the kitchen! Anyway, it is good to remember that others are doing this work too!
Thanks for taking a minute to share. It is ok! You are doing the most important work by literally sustaining the life of your baby! You are certainly not the only one, and I’ll tell you what I tell myself: Christ sees you.
I hope you are able to enjoy your family in your own way, and that your children are blessed by the time with grandparents. Great things to talk about for next year with your husband, right? ….in a couple weeks, maybe. 😅
Thanks Leah. I am now nursing my baby down for bed. The rest of the evening was very nice and there was plenty of activity left for me to engage in. I missed only on a small amount. And I know my time with my baby is short!
Next year will feel different than this year, since toddler needs are different.
It is interesting to take a step back and consider how to explain Advent to family. When people feel like the Christmas season ends on the 26th, being invited after Christmas can feel like a slight I suppose. Definitely something to work out—or perhaps just explain to our kids and hope that in the long run our family can develop a practice of waiting to dive into Christmas celebrations until after Christmas, even if that takes some patience since so many loved ones have a different practice.
Even with this gathering, we have managed to save plenty of special things for Christmas Day.
Praying for wisdom in this! We've explained it to our families and I think many of them appreciate the fact that they can save our gifts to send or buy for last -- they know they have until January 6th! Ha.
Back to Amber's article, Amber, I thank you for putting on our hearts the way we receive children into our homes and families. We can't change the practices of others - whether it's when we open presents or how we engage in conversation with mothers - but your reflections on this can help shape us to make changes in our own lives, for today and the future, so that people with children feel welcome in our own homes. God bless!
I really appreciate this attention to this topic, Amber. I also have felt this rage welling up inside of me at social gatherings and I think it is a combination of feeling dismissed mixed with my own frustration with not being able to move freely about to socialize with ease if I am completely honest.
I also agree that as you have more children, it just becomes easier, sometimes it is also quite nice to have an excuse to leave early or to excuse yourself and take a quiet moment in a quiet room away from the excitement. It is something you come to expect as well, as yourself and many other women have already mentioned here.
It’s just another both/and situation that comes with motherhood in this society/environment I think. We want to be included of course, but sometimes that inclusion simply must look different.
Like we have already talked over, I do think a big part of this is people just not knowing how to be around young children. As more of our peers have either no children or wait longer and longer to do so, less of them know how to play with and tend to and tolerate babies and kids. I also think many of the people in our parent’s generation do not fully immerse themselves in the care of grandchildren the way some older generations did, both because geography and families being very spread out often physically inhibits this and also because I think there can be a sort of selfishness in some of their attitudes, like “I raised my kids, I put my time in, come take a picture with me and then go back to your mom” kind of thing. I hate to generalize because there are certainly very involved, loving grandparents of the same generation but I think my job makes me uniquely privy to these dynamics and it is something I see a lot and hear mothers feeling distressed about unfortunately.
I'm grateful I don't have parents who act like that, but I too have heard over and over that they exist. Ugh, I can't imagine how much harder that is. As Dixie said, we truly have so much rebuilding to do!
This is really interesting to me and something I’ve definitely noticed at American social gatherings. Even when we have people over, people who don’t have kids don’t seem to know what to do with them. I don’t personally experience this with family - both my family and my husband’s dote on the kids so they become an area of focus at any gathering, and we get plenty of help. But my family is Indian, and my husband’s Eastern European so different cultural norms operate. I did notice the intense contrast on vacation in India though - there everyone seems to cooperate in entertaining the kids - for better or worse, people treat kids kind of communally - so they might tell them off, or drag them off somewhere in a way American parents might baulk at - but also they show them stuff and indulge their random chatter. This went both for the older aunties and uncles as well as the young college aged people who seemed to have both interest in and experience with young kids in a way I don’t see here.
Thank you for this, Amber! I think some of it comes from people just being so unfamiliar with shared spaces with children. We have lost our sense of how one behaves toward babies and toddlers. So when you show up with one, it's your "problem." Nobody knows what to do so they ignore!
It's lovely when someone *does* know how to help or include, isn't it!! We need to rebuild this. Some situations are better than others with this!
Yes, I so agree Dixie! Your comment speaks to what I'm trying to say, I think: that this isn't individual failings but rather symptomatic of a fragmented and unhealthy culture. Yes to rebuilding!
I feel this so deeply. We've talked with many friends who have experienced the same thing and have noticed the pattern that it's worst for those who are the first in their families to have young kids. It's like extended family forgots what it's like to have toddlers or babies around! I cried every year on Christmas for at least five years, and it all came down to feeling so isolated and ignored. And now that one other relative has young kids, everyone is bending over backwards to make sure her family is fully included. Which is a lovely thing and exactly how it should be! But where was that attitude six years ago when I was drowning with 3 under 4 who were treated as a disruption?
Yes. I was the first in my family to have kids and the first of my ten cousins on the side of the family we see the most. And yes, I see kids and caregivers being waaay more accomodated now;) Frustrating. I do think there's a forgetting, and then layered on top of that is our cultural disregard for care.
This resonates with me so much Amber. I’ve often felt invisible at social gatherings since becoming a mother, even with my immediate family. I’ve definitely felt frustrated and upset and even angry about it at times, but then I probably was similar before I had kids. Like you point out, our culture does a lousy job of accommodating for the needs of kids and their caregivers.
Yes, agree - I've thought about that too, how I would have acted before I had kids! My family (immediate and extended) is a pretty caring and stable one. This is, IMO, fundamentally a deep-seated issue of cultural values.
Reminds me of when I was 12 and my little sister was born 4 days before Christmas. My mum only agreed to come to the family Christmas on Christmas Day if dinner could be early and it ended up being really late. My mum was so mad, rightfully so as a newly postpartum mama! People just don’t prioritise your needs when you have children and it sucks.
As a mum now myself it is bizarre how you can be invisible at gatherings. I’m lucky my family is very accommodating and understanding most of the time
Thanks for sharing these experiences. I do feel parents are marginalized because we truly just aren't in touch collectively with the realities of caretaking. Or the honor of the work. Bizarre is a good word for it.
This really resonated. I felt the stark social change when I had my first. However, particularly in the Catholic sphere, I've also seen my unmarried female friends deeply pained by a similar ostracization when their friends marry and have children, and conversation seems to move solely to those experiences...seems we just need a re-education in the art of conversation all around.
I don't think you're wrong, and I don't think that contradicts what I'm saying here. I think the marginalization of people without kids in faith spaces is definitely a problem (though you'd think it would be less so in Catholicism when there's such a robust definition of motherhood). Thanks for reading!
We have a single lady at church (who runs everything and has been there for decades, you probably know the type) who is very attentive to caregivers, both when socializing at church and when she hosts people at her home. But what she can do to help is limited by how willing kids are to talk with her or play with her. She literally has bags of toys and coloring materials, but if they’re not used to adults paying them any attention and feel shy, they cling to a leg and the parent doesn’t get a break. This gets better with exposure but it takes a while, and most adults give up rather than persist, or they don’t know how to make kids comfortable, because they’re not around kids much and use weird baby talk.
I also get so ragey sometimes - especially on family beach week when people tell me to just go for a walk or relax and I totally would if anybody would manage all three kids without sugar or a screen for 30 minutes
It’s interesting, as an introvert I sometimes find that my children almost become something I hide behind in social situations. I have made many a joke about not knowing what to do at family gatherings after I don’t have a baby to nurse. But I also see what you’re getting at here. I think a lot depends on the context, and because I’m not one to fight for my voice to be heard, there’s been many conversations where I’ve sat quiet, or been interrupted.
I’ve been in groups that made me feel small and stupid, and also places where I’ve felt free to take up more space. I wonder now how much of that is my own security or insecurity coming to play. But I also do think I’ve been fortunate to be in a lot of kid inclusive spaces. My husband’s family is huge, so there have always been kids running around wreaking havoc. I can see it being so much more stressful in an environment where I’m the anomaly
I do think you bring up something interesting re: insecurity... I think part of the problem for me in the very early years was that I didn't feel like "enough" socially because of my role as a "SAHM" and all the stereotypes that entails. Part of the shift for me for sure was becoming more comfortable in my identity as a mother (and "just" a mother, for the most part) and truly confident in what I'm contributing.
I really appreciated reading this, Amber! My experience has been different (I wonder if because my son is the first grandkid on both sides) and I would say my main challenge is sometimes feeling smothered or that too many people want to hold my baby. It's a nice problem to have in some ways but it can also send my anxiety into the stratosphere. I have a feeling I will start getting a lot of editorial comments as my son enters toddlerhood, too, which will be challenging.
This essay made me appreciate my in-laws and my own family though. Thank you!
Thank you for sharing this!! As a new mom, I feel like I’m not able to feel negative emotions around motherhood sometimes, let alone share them with others so I appreciate you being willing to do so! I have often felt this way, especially in the sense that I just feel invisible now period where only my baby and she’s doing and if her needs are met comepltely overshadow what’s going on with me. The funny (but not so funny) part is that other people have made me feel this way (more so extended family) and not so much caring for my baby because I know she needs me in a very consuming way right now and is so new to the world and trying to navigating everything. But the dismissal that I’ve felt from others (even when I was freshly postpartum and even more so now that I am pregnant again and really struggling at times) has been so heavy on me so it’s nice to know I’m not alone.
Yes, caring for ourselves while in the thick of caring for a baby (especially the first) is really a challenge in these times. Ideally, in a culture that valued the correct things, everyone would be cognizant of helping to meet the needs of the mother while she meets the needs of her baby. I'm grateful that I have some of that - for example, my mother always made sure I had food, and sometimes would even literally feed me while I was breastfeeding and had no free hands but was starving. I haven't thought about that for a while - I should thank my her for that.
It's absolutely not baby's fault she/he is so needy! Babies are needy! It's the adults around us that need to step it up. I hope that with this next baby you have all the support you need!
Thank you for this post, Amber. I think often that mothers with young children become invisible in a sense. It used to be that children were allowed at adult dinner tables as long as they were "seen and not heard." But now, many adults simply do not allow children at adult dinners *at all*. We are losing so many important connections with the strict segregation between different types of people: if we don't welcome babies at events, it's hard for their moms to come. If we don't make space for young moms, they don't come with their young kids, and then kids don't form the social connections that are so important for young AND OLD alike (after all, we are all - hopefully - going to get old one day, and presumably want our now-grown kids to still hang out with us occasionally).
I've found sometimes the disconnect in these social settings comes from other parents who project their own experiences and preferences. Some parents feel they can only really enjoy adult conversation if their kids aren't there–so they prioritize moms nights out, have someone watch the kids when they invite another couple over for dinner, that sort of thing. Others really thrive on gatherings where all the kids play together in one space while all the adults chat on the sidelines. If you incline strongly toward one of these, it can be hard to understand why someone would want to bring a child to an adult event, or on the other hand, why they would leave them at home! And non-parents are often unsure of navigating the subject at all, and make things extra awkward whether you bring the child with you or not (I personally love when non-parents ask about wildly off-base milestones-"oh wow he's almost 2! is he learning to read?")!
My experiences have actually been mostly at family gatherings, actually! But I understand what you're saying and I think that's probably true!
I'm not sure I agree with your differentiation though: I think *all* adults would probably prefer to socialize without little kids around, lol. It's difficult! Kid-friendly gatherings are simply what I need as it's the season I'm in, and I want my kids to be integrated into community life so in general it feels weird to me to leave them behind while we go out and do things. So it's not that I "really thrive" in gatherings where kids are present; it's that they feel respectful and honoring of me as a caregiver and of my children as people who also deserve to have social experiences.
I so agree with your last part - it seems we're just so collectively out of touch with the realities of caregiving and family life until we become parents ourselves. I wish it wasn't like that.
This is such a good point Carolyn! I’ve noticed this dynamic with mom friends - I try and organise day time activities with kids in tow, they mostly want to organize evening wine dates or dinners which I never attend because even though my second is almost one, I don’t like leaving her in the evening unless I have too. With my family the dynamic is much more like Amber described - kids welcome but not always accommodated for.
I fall somewhere in the middle - I love a good moms night out or brunch birthday party, but I also find that kids are sometimes unecessarily excluded from events that are well-suited to children (fortunately in my circles, nursing infants are always welcome). At the same time, I empathize that some moms really can't "multitask" socializing and watching their kids, especially if their little ones are prone to running or destruction. And I readily admit that of the half dozen or so weddings we've brought our 2yo to, the most enjoyable were the ones with childcare provided. It's definitely a complex dynamic that differs from family to family, and I think it's helpful to try to give people options (e.g. I am in a wedding this summer, my friend said that if I wanted to bring my toddler, he could be a ringbearer, but if I preferred to leave him with childcare, that was fine too! And I so appreciate this accommodation).
Oh man, I am literally reading through every comment on here because this topic is so intriguing and I feel it deeply. While we have no regrets about having kids close (it's our life! we welcomed them into it!) the sheer reality of having three boys within three years of each other has been brutal on any sort of socializing outside of free play literally outside. I have left more than one semi-structured indoor play date or time after church in tears or about to be. There are ways in which "multitasking" while trying to converse for longer than 45 seconds gets incredibly defeating, bordering on impossible, when three tiny, very physical boys are together--not to mention with other kids or in a new environment or home. It sometimes makes me (to my detriment) sadly envious or jaded of others with more "proper spacing" of children, who seem to have an easier time in those situations... or have different expectations of what kids being together should look like because of it. I have nothing more to add to this conversation. It just hits such a tender spot in my life. But thank you for writing it, Amber!
Yes, having several close together (even two!) is a special kind of hard, especially in those early years. I don't have boys, but boys are often more physical by nature, it seems, and so there's probably more supervision re: making sure things don't get broken, etc. People are very precious about their possessions and so I can imagine this is very hard! Hang in there - it's a season. AND, you, like the rest of us, deserve a more child-friendly culture than we have.
So curious about these weddings! Are you saying there's childcare on-site? Is it integrated into the celebration or totally separate? I've never heard of this!
One wedding we went to had babysitters at both the Church & reception (the Lutheran church had a dedicated nursery for during Sunday service) and one only had them at the reception (in both cases they were local or distantly related teenage girls hired by the wedding host to do the babysitting). Surprisingly, we were the only parents who took advantage of it for the whole time! (bubs came back to us for dinner while the babysitters ate, and then back to the room with the toys during for the rest of the reception).
Interesting! Thanks for sharing! I was talking with another friend about this and she said there are also sometimes caretakers hired to watch kids in a way where they are more present in the celebration. I think these are fantastic ideas and very supportive of parents and children. Ideally weddings would be child-friendly events, I think, but if they're not, on-site childcare is lovely. None of the weddings of my cousins had that. All were simply "kids are not invited."
I resonate with this! The dynamic shifts so intensely with littles. I recently attended a 1 year old birthday party with my toddler and infant. Most attendees were child-less or with children that were older. I was so resentful of their adult conversations, catch-ups and beers while I pushed the infant on a swing while the toddler climbed the Playset.
I also feel so much frustration for "child free" parties held by friends. We have young kids and while we have support in family, asking them to watch the kids multiple times over the holidays just isn't feasible or fair to them. I love that they have Christmas and New Year's parties, but boy do I wish they were family centric.
Oh, do I know the hanging out with the kids alone at parties experience! Your description felt so very familiar!
Other than the weddings of my cousins, we thankfully haven't been invited to "child-free" events. (I guess my husband's work Christmas party, but that was at a bar at 8pm so sort of obviously child-free, ha.) In general, to me child-free events feel generally gross in the context of our childist culture. It would be one thing if our society was super supportive of family life - then, child-free events would hit different, as a time for adults to relax and socialize without the work of care. But as things are, their prevalence feels more like one more step toward dystopia.
Reading this made me realize how special our community is! We've been growing a Catholic neighborhood, where there are gatherings multiple times a week. We host dinner every Friday and there's brunch elsewhere every Sunday.
Most couples have kids and the adults without kids are like aunts and uncles to our kids. There's a joking competition on who is godparent to the most children (we have five godchildren and aren't close to winning this game). There are always lots of kids and babies at weekly gatherings and the two annual picnics. We host Thanksgiving every year and we invite any friends who don't have other plans, and if they have kids, they bring their kids.
Our single adult friends are, according to their personality, always ready to either read to a kid or play pretend and chase older kids or hold a baby. When I'm at brunch, having an interesting conversation with an adult, sometimes I stop and say, "Where's [my toddler]?" Then I look around and he's either playing with other kids supervised by a friend or has a friend reading to him. I usually say, "High trust society!" And go back to the conversation.
I've occasionally felt a small bit of what you wrote about, but only when visiting relatives without children. So much of my life is surrounded by big families that I forget we're not the norm! Big hugs to you and all parents for whom this isolation is a common occurrence, especially at holidays!
How incredibly beautiful. I'd love to hear more what you mean exactly by "growing a Catholic neighborhood." We're always hoping for like-hearted neighbors to move in (our area is older and is rapidly turning over).
Some of us young families from our parish do get together monthly for a casual dinner/social evening. With the twenty-something kids among us! We started last summer and it's been something I really look forward to.
We picked a few streets (within a block or two of the Catholic church and Bible study center) and have a real estate chat. We have a cadre of Catholic families all trying to live within a three block area.
Griffin, who lives in the neighborhood like I do, writes about our efforts here:
https://medium.com/@griffindjones/the-benedit-option-intentional-catholic-community-in-rochester-ny-ccb6deec6aba
Our weekly dinners and encouragement to others to experiment in hosting:
https://faithandwitness.org/2024/07/16/how-about-dinner/
I loved reading how your perspective has changed over the years. There were times in early motherhood in which I felt unnoticed, and I’ve noticed the feeling creep back in whenever I’m pregnant — probably because I need help with managing a child and vomiting/using the bathroom, depending on trimester. There were stages in which we went out when we should have stayed home.
Over time, I’ve found it helpful to prepare my children for the gatherings (like, on a daily basis: following house rules, teaching not to touch, etc) and prepare myself to exit gatherings early. I feel less like my own individual self, and more like an important leader of this family who need me along with my husband to protect and meet their needs. It’s a good feeling of ceasing to exist, because a greater existence was borne. It’s taken time to get there.
And when I do get into conversation, I just try to ask a lot of questions of others, and it’s usually quite enjoyable for both of us, I hope.
I really appreciate this post and the opportunity to reflect on how our stages and handling of the hard situations change over the years.
"It’s a good feeling of ceasing to exist, because a greater existence was borne." - Yes, you're getting at something there. I feel it too! Perhaps it's touching on beginning to experience the beauty of interdependence in a culture that's obsessed with the opposite.
I too try to ask a lot of questions of others. I do have to mentally prepare myself though for no questions to be asked of me, which has often been my experience, as it seems no one knows what things I'm up to or that there would be anything interesting to talk about ;)
I agree, Amber, that bracing ourselves to be overlooked is fundamental to this. It’s not pleasant, but it can also provide great opportunity for us to show love in beholding others, rather than asking that we ourselves be beheld.
Christ sees me, that is enough. Is what I tell myself when I get sad about this.
Leah and Amber-Interestingly, I am experiencing in this moment. I am in my own home with a baby who needs to nurse and take a late nap. My in-laws came before Christmas (taking a deep breath and trying to remember that not everyone understands Advent like my Substack friends 😂). Anyway, my older kids have the Christmas crazies starting and everyone is engaging with them. That means present opening is happening out there without me. It is ok. My husband and in-laws are just trying to help while I focus on the baby. But even in my own home there is not really space for us. I can’t let her crawl at my feet while I cook when there are 3 extra cooks in the kitchen! Anyway, it is good to remember that others are doing this work too!
Thanks for taking a minute to share. It is ok! You are doing the most important work by literally sustaining the life of your baby! You are certainly not the only one, and I’ll tell you what I tell myself: Christ sees you.
I hope you are able to enjoy your family in your own way, and that your children are blessed by the time with grandparents. Great things to talk about for next year with your husband, right? ….in a couple weeks, maybe. 😅
Yes! May we remember these feelings and reach out to other parents, now and in the future.
Thanks Leah. I am now nursing my baby down for bed. The rest of the evening was very nice and there was plenty of activity left for me to engage in. I missed only on a small amount. And I know my time with my baby is short!
Next year will feel different than this year, since toddler needs are different.
It is interesting to take a step back and consider how to explain Advent to family. When people feel like the Christmas season ends on the 26th, being invited after Christmas can feel like a slight I suppose. Definitely something to work out—or perhaps just explain to our kids and hope that in the long run our family can develop a practice of waiting to dive into Christmas celebrations until after Christmas, even if that takes some patience since so many loved ones have a different practice.
Even with this gathering, we have managed to save plenty of special things for Christmas Day.
Happy Advent!
Praying for wisdom in this! We've explained it to our families and I think many of them appreciate the fact that they can save our gifts to send or buy for last -- they know they have until January 6th! Ha.
Back to Amber's article, Amber, I thank you for putting on our hearts the way we receive children into our homes and families. We can't change the practices of others - whether it's when we open presents or how we engage in conversation with mothers - but your reflections on this can help shape us to make changes in our own lives, for today and the future, so that people with children feel welcome in our own homes. God bless!
I really appreciate this attention to this topic, Amber. I also have felt this rage welling up inside of me at social gatherings and I think it is a combination of feeling dismissed mixed with my own frustration with not being able to move freely about to socialize with ease if I am completely honest.
I also agree that as you have more children, it just becomes easier, sometimes it is also quite nice to have an excuse to leave early or to excuse yourself and take a quiet moment in a quiet room away from the excitement. It is something you come to expect as well, as yourself and many other women have already mentioned here.
It’s just another both/and situation that comes with motherhood in this society/environment I think. We want to be included of course, but sometimes that inclusion simply must look different.
Like we have already talked over, I do think a big part of this is people just not knowing how to be around young children. As more of our peers have either no children or wait longer and longer to do so, less of them know how to play with and tend to and tolerate babies and kids. I also think many of the people in our parent’s generation do not fully immerse themselves in the care of grandchildren the way some older generations did, both because geography and families being very spread out often physically inhibits this and also because I think there can be a sort of selfishness in some of their attitudes, like “I raised my kids, I put my time in, come take a picture with me and then go back to your mom” kind of thing. I hate to generalize because there are certainly very involved, loving grandparents of the same generation but I think my job makes me uniquely privy to these dynamics and it is something I see a lot and hear mothers feeling distressed about unfortunately.
I'm grateful I don't have parents who act like that, but I too have heard over and over that they exist. Ugh, I can't imagine how much harder that is. As Dixie said, we truly have so much rebuilding to do!
Thanks for weighing in Em xx
This is really interesting to me and something I’ve definitely noticed at American social gatherings. Even when we have people over, people who don’t have kids don’t seem to know what to do with them. I don’t personally experience this with family - both my family and my husband’s dote on the kids so they become an area of focus at any gathering, and we get plenty of help. But my family is Indian, and my husband’s Eastern European so different cultural norms operate. I did notice the intense contrast on vacation in India though - there everyone seems to cooperate in entertaining the kids - for better or worse, people treat kids kind of communally - so they might tell them off, or drag them off somewhere in a way American parents might baulk at - but also they show them stuff and indulge their random chatter. This went both for the older aunties and uncles as well as the young college aged people who seemed to have both interest in and experience with young kids in a way I don’t see here.
Hi Anu — thank you for taking the time to share! This really illustrates the things I’m saying here, I think.
Thank you for this, Amber! I think some of it comes from people just being so unfamiliar with shared spaces with children. We have lost our sense of how one behaves toward babies and toddlers. So when you show up with one, it's your "problem." Nobody knows what to do so they ignore!
It's lovely when someone *does* know how to help or include, isn't it!! We need to rebuild this. Some situations are better than others with this!
Yes, I so agree Dixie! Your comment speaks to what I'm trying to say, I think: that this isn't individual failings but rather symptomatic of a fragmented and unhealthy culture. Yes to rebuilding!
I feel this so deeply. We've talked with many friends who have experienced the same thing and have noticed the pattern that it's worst for those who are the first in their families to have young kids. It's like extended family forgots what it's like to have toddlers or babies around! I cried every year on Christmas for at least five years, and it all came down to feeling so isolated and ignored. And now that one other relative has young kids, everyone is bending over backwards to make sure her family is fully included. Which is a lovely thing and exactly how it should be! But where was that attitude six years ago when I was drowning with 3 under 4 who were treated as a disruption?
Yes. I was the first in my family to have kids and the first of my ten cousins on the side of the family we see the most. And yes, I see kids and caregivers being waaay more accomodated now;) Frustrating. I do think there's a forgetting, and then layered on top of that is our cultural disregard for care.
Thank you for sharing so candidly, friend.
This resonates with me so much Amber. I’ve often felt invisible at social gatherings since becoming a mother, even with my immediate family. I’ve definitely felt frustrated and upset and even angry about it at times, but then I probably was similar before I had kids. Like you point out, our culture does a lousy job of accommodating for the needs of kids and their caregivers.
Yes, agree - I've thought about that too, how I would have acted before I had kids! My family (immediate and extended) is a pretty caring and stable one. This is, IMO, fundamentally a deep-seated issue of cultural values.
Thanks for your comment Becca xx
Reminds me of when I was 12 and my little sister was born 4 days before Christmas. My mum only agreed to come to the family Christmas on Christmas Day if dinner could be early and it ended up being really late. My mum was so mad, rightfully so as a newly postpartum mama! People just don’t prioritise your needs when you have children and it sucks.
As a mum now myself it is bizarre how you can be invisible at gatherings. I’m lucky my family is very accommodating and understanding most of the time
Thanks for sharing these experiences. I do feel parents are marginalized because we truly just aren't in touch collectively with the realities of caretaking. Or the honor of the work. Bizarre is a good word for it.
This really resonated. I felt the stark social change when I had my first. However, particularly in the Catholic sphere, I've also seen my unmarried female friends deeply pained by a similar ostracization when their friends marry and have children, and conversation seems to move solely to those experiences...seems we just need a re-education in the art of conversation all around.
I don't think you're wrong, and I don't think that contradicts what I'm saying here. I think the marginalization of people without kids in faith spaces is definitely a problem (though you'd think it would be less so in Catholicism when there's such a robust definition of motherhood). Thanks for reading!
Thanks for writing.
We have a single lady at church (who runs everything and has been there for decades, you probably know the type) who is very attentive to caregivers, both when socializing at church and when she hosts people at her home. But what she can do to help is limited by how willing kids are to talk with her or play with her. She literally has bags of toys and coloring materials, but if they’re not used to adults paying them any attention and feel shy, they cling to a leg and the parent doesn’t get a break. This gets better with exposure but it takes a while, and most adults give up rather than persist, or they don’t know how to make kids comfortable, because they’re not around kids much and use weird baby talk.
I also get so ragey sometimes - especially on family beach week when people tell me to just go for a walk or relax and I totally would if anybody would manage all three kids without sugar or a screen for 30 minutes
It’s interesting, as an introvert I sometimes find that my children almost become something I hide behind in social situations. I have made many a joke about not knowing what to do at family gatherings after I don’t have a baby to nurse. But I also see what you’re getting at here. I think a lot depends on the context, and because I’m not one to fight for my voice to be heard, there’s been many conversations where I’ve sat quiet, or been interrupted.
I’ve been in groups that made me feel small and stupid, and also places where I’ve felt free to take up more space. I wonder now how much of that is my own security or insecurity coming to play. But I also do think I’ve been fortunate to be in a lot of kid inclusive spaces. My husband’s family is huge, so there have always been kids running around wreaking havoc. I can see it being so much more stressful in an environment where I’m the anomaly
I do think you bring up something interesting re: insecurity... I think part of the problem for me in the very early years was that I didn't feel like "enough" socially because of my role as a "SAHM" and all the stereotypes that entails. Part of the shift for me for sure was becoming more comfortable in my identity as a mother (and "just" a mother, for the most part) and truly confident in what I'm contributing.
I really appreciated reading this, Amber! My experience has been different (I wonder if because my son is the first grandkid on both sides) and I would say my main challenge is sometimes feeling smothered or that too many people want to hold my baby. It's a nice problem to have in some ways but it can also send my anxiety into the stratosphere. I have a feeling I will start getting a lot of editorial comments as my son enters toddlerhood, too, which will be challenging.
This essay made me appreciate my in-laws and my own family though. Thank you!
Thank you for sharing this!! As a new mom, I feel like I’m not able to feel negative emotions around motherhood sometimes, let alone share them with others so I appreciate you being willing to do so! I have often felt this way, especially in the sense that I just feel invisible now period where only my baby and she’s doing and if her needs are met comepltely overshadow what’s going on with me. The funny (but not so funny) part is that other people have made me feel this way (more so extended family) and not so much caring for my baby because I know she needs me in a very consuming way right now and is so new to the world and trying to navigating everything. But the dismissal that I’ve felt from others (even when I was freshly postpartum and even more so now that I am pregnant again and really struggling at times) has been so heavy on me so it’s nice to know I’m not alone.
Yes, caring for ourselves while in the thick of caring for a baby (especially the first) is really a challenge in these times. Ideally, in a culture that valued the correct things, everyone would be cognizant of helping to meet the needs of the mother while she meets the needs of her baby. I'm grateful that I have some of that - for example, my mother always made sure I had food, and sometimes would even literally feed me while I was breastfeeding and had no free hands but was starving. I haven't thought about that for a while - I should thank my her for that.
It's absolutely not baby's fault she/he is so needy! Babies are needy! It's the adults around us that need to step it up. I hope that with this next baby you have all the support you need!
It’s so beautiful that your mom did that for you, I hope you get a chance to thank her! And thank you for the kind words, I hope I’ll have it as well!
Thank you for this post, Amber. I think often that mothers with young children become invisible in a sense. It used to be that children were allowed at adult dinner tables as long as they were "seen and not heard." But now, many adults simply do not allow children at adult dinners *at all*. We are losing so many important connections with the strict segregation between different types of people: if we don't welcome babies at events, it's hard for their moms to come. If we don't make space for young moms, they don't come with their young kids, and then kids don't form the social connections that are so important for young AND OLD alike (after all, we are all - hopefully - going to get old one day, and presumably want our now-grown kids to still hang out with us occasionally).
I've found sometimes the disconnect in these social settings comes from other parents who project their own experiences and preferences. Some parents feel they can only really enjoy adult conversation if their kids aren't there–so they prioritize moms nights out, have someone watch the kids when they invite another couple over for dinner, that sort of thing. Others really thrive on gatherings where all the kids play together in one space while all the adults chat on the sidelines. If you incline strongly toward one of these, it can be hard to understand why someone would want to bring a child to an adult event, or on the other hand, why they would leave them at home! And non-parents are often unsure of navigating the subject at all, and make things extra awkward whether you bring the child with you or not (I personally love when non-parents ask about wildly off-base milestones-"oh wow he's almost 2! is he learning to read?")!
My experiences have actually been mostly at family gatherings, actually! But I understand what you're saying and I think that's probably true!
I'm not sure I agree with your differentiation though: I think *all* adults would probably prefer to socialize without little kids around, lol. It's difficult! Kid-friendly gatherings are simply what I need as it's the season I'm in, and I want my kids to be integrated into community life so in general it feels weird to me to leave them behind while we go out and do things. So it's not that I "really thrive" in gatherings where kids are present; it's that they feel respectful and honoring of me as a caregiver and of my children as people who also deserve to have social experiences.
I so agree with your last part - it seems we're just so collectively out of touch with the realities of caregiving and family life until we become parents ourselves. I wish it wasn't like that.
This is such a good point Carolyn! I’ve noticed this dynamic with mom friends - I try and organise day time activities with kids in tow, they mostly want to organize evening wine dates or dinners which I never attend because even though my second is almost one, I don’t like leaving her in the evening unless I have too. With my family the dynamic is much more like Amber described - kids welcome but not always accommodated for.
I fall somewhere in the middle - I love a good moms night out or brunch birthday party, but I also find that kids are sometimes unecessarily excluded from events that are well-suited to children (fortunately in my circles, nursing infants are always welcome). At the same time, I empathize that some moms really can't "multitask" socializing and watching their kids, especially if their little ones are prone to running or destruction. And I readily admit that of the half dozen or so weddings we've brought our 2yo to, the most enjoyable were the ones with childcare provided. It's definitely a complex dynamic that differs from family to family, and I think it's helpful to try to give people options (e.g. I am in a wedding this summer, my friend said that if I wanted to bring my toddler, he could be a ringbearer, but if I preferred to leave him with childcare, that was fine too! And I so appreciate this accommodation).
Oh man, I am literally reading through every comment on here because this topic is so intriguing and I feel it deeply. While we have no regrets about having kids close (it's our life! we welcomed them into it!) the sheer reality of having three boys within three years of each other has been brutal on any sort of socializing outside of free play literally outside. I have left more than one semi-structured indoor play date or time after church in tears or about to be. There are ways in which "multitasking" while trying to converse for longer than 45 seconds gets incredibly defeating, bordering on impossible, when three tiny, very physical boys are together--not to mention with other kids or in a new environment or home. It sometimes makes me (to my detriment) sadly envious or jaded of others with more "proper spacing" of children, who seem to have an easier time in those situations... or have different expectations of what kids being together should look like because of it. I have nothing more to add to this conversation. It just hits such a tender spot in my life. But thank you for writing it, Amber!
Yes, having several close together (even two!) is a special kind of hard, especially in those early years. I don't have boys, but boys are often more physical by nature, it seems, and so there's probably more supervision re: making sure things don't get broken, etc. People are very precious about their possessions and so I can imagine this is very hard! Hang in there - it's a season. AND, you, like the rest of us, deserve a more child-friendly culture than we have.
This is a great point about high-needs kids.
So curious about these weddings! Are you saying there's childcare on-site? Is it integrated into the celebration or totally separate? I've never heard of this!
One wedding we went to had babysitters at both the Church & reception (the Lutheran church had a dedicated nursery for during Sunday service) and one only had them at the reception (in both cases they were local or distantly related teenage girls hired by the wedding host to do the babysitting). Surprisingly, we were the only parents who took advantage of it for the whole time! (bubs came back to us for dinner while the babysitters ate, and then back to the room with the toys during for the rest of the reception).
Interesting! Thanks for sharing! I was talking with another friend about this and she said there are also sometimes caretakers hired to watch kids in a way where they are more present in the celebration. I think these are fantastic ideas and very supportive of parents and children. Ideally weddings would be child-friendly events, I think, but if they're not, on-site childcare is lovely. None of the weddings of my cousins had that. All were simply "kids are not invited."
I resonate with this! The dynamic shifts so intensely with littles. I recently attended a 1 year old birthday party with my toddler and infant. Most attendees were child-less or with children that were older. I was so resentful of their adult conversations, catch-ups and beers while I pushed the infant on a swing while the toddler climbed the Playset.
I also feel so much frustration for "child free" parties held by friends. We have young kids and while we have support in family, asking them to watch the kids multiple times over the holidays just isn't feasible or fair to them. I love that they have Christmas and New Year's parties, but boy do I wish they were family centric.
Oh, do I know the hanging out with the kids alone at parties experience! Your description felt so very familiar!
Other than the weddings of my cousins, we thankfully haven't been invited to "child-free" events. (I guess my husband's work Christmas party, but that was at a bar at 8pm so sort of obviously child-free, ha.) In general, to me child-free events feel generally gross in the context of our childist culture. It would be one thing if our society was super supportive of family life - then, child-free events would hit different, as a time for adults to relax and socialize without the work of care. But as things are, their prevalence feels more like one more step toward dystopia.